I need help from any auto minded mechanics who come here please.

Ron took our 2018 Ford Escape to the dealership this morning for an oil change and that the car ran rough when first started.  On the way there the check engine light came on.  No blinking but steady.  So the dealership told Ron that to even do the tests would be $360 plus the cost of the oil change along with any needed repairs.  They came back to Ron nearly 2 hours later and told him we needed a new engine for $10,000 because of a dome spark plug clearance problem.  Ron told them he drove it there with no issues and he was driving it home.  I called Randy who has some knowledge and works with mechanics who say that it is possible but not likely and that the engine should go for $3,500 not $10,000.  I found online that normally it is the plug that is the problem, using the wrong plug or the plug specs have changed a small amount.  But like anything online I couldn’t find a real clear answer.  I could use some help if anyone out there understands engines and this stuff.  Thanks and hugs

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Published by Scotties Playtime

I am an older gay guy in a long-term wonderful relationship. My spouse and I are in our 36th year together. I love politics and news. I enjoy civil discussions and have no taboo subjects. My pronouns are he / him / his and my email is Scottiestoybox@gmail.com

19 thoughts on “I need help from any auto minded mechanics who come here please.”

  1. First step, get a second opinion.

    We have a couple of auto parts stores that will plug in their hand code readers to read the check engine light code and tell you what it means. They just interpret the top code for you but do it for free, probably because a lot of times people buy parts there to fix the problem.

    Second step would be to find a better mechanic than I used to be. The most complicated thing I’ve done on my own is probably changing wheel bearings. Engines are much more complex.

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    1. Hi MDavis. Good points. We have an Auto Zone here that will do it for you. We have had them do it for us before. Ron had a warning light come on and took it over there. It was a small part on the back wheel that was part of the automatic braking system. But they gave Ron the name of a guy who is a mechanic who works out of his home and will even come to your house. He went with Ron to get the part, he was so well known to them that he just went behind the counter, found the part, showed it to them and they put it on his tab he has with them. He offered to do the oil change but he wanted Ron to bring all the stuff. He has one of those big testers. He works only for cash. Ron went to the dealer because he thought it would be convenient, sort of in and out quickly deal. After all it was just an oil change. Boy was he wrong. If the light had come on before he went down he would have that guy check it out, but it did not come on until he was nearly there. Monday he will call the guy, explain what happened and ask him to check it out. He will be the one we go to for now on. We are done with the Ford dealership. As for complicated they have made it impossible to change your own battery in this car. You have to take off half the stuff on the right side of the motor to do it. Hugs

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  2. Randy is correct, and so is M ~ get a different mechanic, this one is trying to pull one over on you. Even with the slowest of labor motor shouldn’t cost 10K. If it’s running a little rough in the mornings it could just be the need for a timing adjustment …

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    1. Hi Ten Bears. Yes they tried to extort Ron. The car has run find since Ron drove it home. He started it this morning and it ran fine. The code that was on the paper work was different from what he was told while waiting. They told him it was a spark plug dome clearance issue and the engine was shot needing to be replaced. Yet Ron drove it in and told them he was going to be driving it out. They argued with him telling him it could do further damage to the engine. That made Ron understand what was going on. He told them what would be the difference as you just told me it was shot and needed to be replaced? The paper work said the diagnostic test code said that the “spark plug had seized. Intrusion of coolant into the cylinder. Replace spark plug”. Ron asked what spark plugs they put in and the service person said they never replaced them or tried to. They only changed the oil and rotated the tires along with checking the fluids. Ron has a mechanic who works from his home or will come to your house. He has done a couple repairs for us and was great. He only accepts cash for payment. We should have used him. We will next time. We are done with Ford especially that Ford dealership. Hugs

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    1. Hi Michael. Thanks for the information. Turns out they lied to Ron. They first told him the thing about the spark plug dome clearance and that the engine needed to be replaced. When he told them he drove it in he was driving it home, they argued with him. No you shouldn’t do that as it could make the engine damage worse. That is when Ron got the idea something was up. He said you just told me the engine was shot, done, needed to be replace for 10 grand, so why would you worry about more damage to it? Who cares right? I am taking my car home. Then it took them another hour to bring it to the front and give him the paper work.   Ron scanned the paper work for the diagnosis code. “Spark plug seized. Intrusion of coolant into the cylinder. Remove spark plug”.

      When Ron asked them what spark plugs they put in the person said they never touched the plugs. In fact they claimed to only have done an oil change which included rotating the tires along with fluid checks. Why it took them 3 hours to do an oil change we have no idea. They have been sending us letters asking us to trade the car in. The car is a top of the line with all the options with most of the maintenance done by them including a program to touch up paint nicks and reapply a clear coat. They wanted the car. I think this was their way of extorting a 70 year old man into selling his car to them in exchange for a new one they would sell him. Hugs

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      1. I’m happy that you guys saw through that shit. Really disturbing that such assholes are out there doing business and conning people. I’m happy that whatever I could offer helped in some way. Hugs ‘n cheers, mon ami.

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  4. Running a little rough on startup sounds more like a MAF sensor, or an 02 sensor. If the plugs were interfering with the pistons, i.e. making contact, that would create an audible noise, and cause severe damage to the pistons. Which would make it run like shit all the time, not just at startup. That would also have showed up on day one, not 7 years later.

    On a non interference engine, the plug dome in the head, the plug itself, the piston, and the clearance at TDC, are fixed values, they do not change. Not in any meaningful way. Only thing I can think of, off the top of my head, that could be an issue, is crank/rod bearings wearing over time, allowing a “smidge” of vertical play. But I can’t see it getting that bad without causing other issues as well, as in low pressure/bearing rattle. There should be at least a few extra thousandths clearance built in to the system anyway. Back in the day hot-rodders would have a few thousandths shaved off the heads and installed high compression dome pistons to make more… compression. There was still clearance between plugs and pistons. I have taken more than a few heads in to be rebuilt and trued. Sometimes heads can warp a bit, and they need planing to get back to square. No plug/piston interference after being torqued in and cranked up.

    An interference engine, is another animal. If the timing belt/or chain, goes wonky, the valves and pistons can collide, causing a catastrophic failure, not “running a bit rough at startup.”

    Sounds like they are running a scam.

    My ’02 Chevy 2500 HD will run a bit rough on startup after we’ve had a few days of rain, then it smooths out. I see no need for a new engine. 😉 When its been dry it runs fine on startup. I don’t know where the moisture is getting in there, but once it burns off it runs normally.

    As others have already said, get a second opinion.

    One more thing, any team of engineers that would design an engine so that there would be plug/piston interference, needs to fired and blacklisted from ever doing anything so stupid again. Same goes for manufacturers of engine parts not to spec, which could also cause the interference.

    Oh, another thing, if it was a design flaw, Ford should be on the hook for the engine replacement, not the buyer. Just to note, it was a Ford dealership that I had issues with too.

    I am not a professional mechanic. I have however been fixing shit for a very long time. Be it outboards, truck/car engines, mowers, motorcycles, and even appliances. Well, maybe I am a bit of a mechanic, I just don’t get paid to do it.

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    1. Hi Shell Digger. Thanks for all the information. It was helpful as when it was happening and Ron called me from the dealership I was online trying desperately to find something on the issue of “what changes spark plug dome clearance” and couldn’t find anything other than spark plugs being wrong for the car. I did get a lot of stuff on dome heads and pistons which I totally did not understand. Sounds like they are running a scam. Yes as I said in the reply to the other comment you made on it. They argued with Ron on leaving with the car. They wanted it or a lot of money for replacing the engine. They then claimed to not have done anything but the oil change. It started fine with no roughness this morning. No leakage in the driveway. I think I told you we recently discovered a good mechanic who works from his home or will come to yours. Ron will call him Monday and see if he will check it over. He will do our work for on. BYW it sounds like you were in to muscle cars in your youth? Thanks again for all you wrote. It helped me understand how deep the scam was. Hugs

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      1. I built a hot rod Camaro once. I miss that car. It was an ’82, originally a V6, I put a V8 400 small block in it, high output ignition, Eldelbrock intake, and Eldlebrock 4 bbl carb. and a shift kit in the tranny. Plus I added a V8 sway bar and springs, to beef up the suspension. That car was like riding a rocket. I’ve worked on every vehicle I’ve had since my first bicycle. It’s just in my blood. I have little doubt, that dealership figured they saw an easy mark. I’m glad Ron didn’t fall for it.

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        1. Wow Shelldigger. What an incredible life you have lived. You followed your dreams and live life to the fullest. Grand to the max. The thing about the dealership was they changed their story from the first time they talked to Ron and when they brought him the car and paperwork. It was like they forgot what they said before. Or wanted Ron to forget it. Hugs

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    2. Hi Shell Digger I looked back at my reply to you on the other post and realized I did not explain the entire scam to you. I will try here. This is what I wrote to Michael above. I thought I had told you in the other post but I failed to do so. Hugs

      They first told him (Ron) the thing about the spark plug dome clearance and that the engine needed to be replaced. When he told them he drove it in he was driving it home, they argued with him. No you shouldn’t do that as it could make the engine damage worse. That is when Ron got the idea something was up. He said you just told me the engine was shot, done, needed to be replace for 10 grand, so why would you worry about more damage to it? Who cares right? I am taking my car home. Then it took them another hour to bring it to the front and give him the paper work.   Ron scanned the paper work for the diagnosis code. “Spark plug seized. Intrusion of coolant into the cylinder. Remove spark plug”.

      When Ron asked them what spark plugs they put in the person said they never touched the plugs. In fact they claimed to only have done an oil change which included rotating the tires along with fluid checks. Why it took them 3 hours to do an oil change we have no idea. They have been sending us letters asking us to trade the car in. The car is a top of the line with all the options with most of the maintenance done by them including a program to touch up paint nicks and reapply a clear coat. They wanted the car. I think this was their way of extorting a 70 year old man into selling his car to them in exchange for a new one they would sell him. 

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      1. Sounds like they couldn’t get their story straight. I reported my Ford dealership to corporate. About 3 months later I got some pathetic, weak sauce response, that did not address any issues at all. I was like wtf? They sure don’t seem to mind how their dealerships are ripping people off.

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        1. Hi Shell digger. There is no smell or smoke. But it reminded me of what happened to me as a naive young 19 yr old in the US Army. I think it was around 1982 I was stationed in Fort Gordon in Georgia for my tech training. I went back to my abusers on Christmas leave and bought a Plymouth Reliant bare car with a four speed for $6,700. I loved that car. To me it was golden. But once I got back to Georgia I took it to the local dealership to have the oil changed. After that I had problems with it. It would be OK then start to idle bad, then when I stopped at a stop sign the car would shut down. I would restart it and give it a little gas to keep it running. I would take it back to the local dealership to have it fixed where they would tell me they rebuilt the carburetor only for it to happen in a week or two again. This happened like 20 times. Then the last time I took it in because it kept stalling they came to me and said. Sorry kid but the car threw a rod through the engine block, we will have to replace the engine. I called my sergeant who was also soon to become my boyfriend. I told him what happened and asked if he could come get me.

          He asked me to tell him the story again. He listened and then asked me one question. Did you drive the car there? I said yes but it kept stalling. He said don’t talk to them other than to tell them not to touch the car. I am on my way. He showed up, when in and came out saying they would be bringing my car out right away. I asked him but they said it could be driven. He said I will explain on the base.

          Turns out it was all a scam. He explained I couldn’t have driven the car if it had thrown a rod, and that they were setting the idle setting on the carburetor to work loose causing the car to stall. He fixed so the car ran great. When I took it to the dealership I bought it from and told them the story they asked if I kept the receipts I said yes, it never cost me because it was under warranty. Then they told me the rest of the scam. That car did not have a carburetor that could be rebuilt. It is a take out, throw away, replace with new part thing. I gave them the paperwork and like you I got a letter from the company a few months later thanking me for helping them stop the fraud but no mention of the grief or time it cost me. No offer of even a free oil change. Hugs

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  5. Hi Scottie; What a great group of people here. I’ve been reading over the comments and there were a couple of times I was racing to look something up better. Thank you everyone for your help!!

    I don’t know if this penchant for greed and abuse has become greater or lesser in these days where it’s harder to work on our own stuff. With my truck, I could crawl into the engine compartment and sit right there working on things. With my Kia I can’t even get my hands in there. When I changed my starter it took me 20 minutes to find it! (taught myself new strings of four letter words that day). As a mechanic I am really good at taking things apart. No so good at fixing and rebuilding. As a bullshit detector, I think your dealership is full of it or incompetent, and I’m not sure which is more troubling. I say keep that shadetree mechanic happy.

    Hugs.

    randy

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    1. Hi Randy. Yes I agree this community is grand and full of wonderful people. You undersell your abilities I think. I have seen the machinery you have at the plant and you jump in to fix them with no hesitation, and more often than not you manage to do it with no training on the repair of the machine. You are with mechanics like Ron is with mechanisms and construction, you can reason it out. I get lost and so frustrated I quit. I do better with computers and stuff like that. Hugs

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