Nicola Sturgeon to announce second Scottish independence vote, defying Westminster

I am confused, can Scotland just vote to leave the UK and then just do it?   Would there be a war or something if they tried?   Here in the US we have a lot of rabid right wingers talk about leaving the Union but it is well known it can not be done unless all states and the federal government agree.   Some say it can not be legally done at all.  Hugs

Speaker Pelosi Holds Photo Opportunity With Scottish First Minister Sturgeon

 Britain is headed for a fresh constitutional crisis as Scotland’s First Minister Nicola Sturgeon prepares to outline plans for a second vote on Scottish independence — with or without Boris Johnson’s agreement.

In a 20-minute speech to lawmakers in the Scottish parliament (Holyrood) on Tuesday, Sturgeon will set out her long-awaited route to some form of a second referendum, vowing to press ahead even if — as expected — Johnson’s U.K. government continues to withhold consent.

The first poll in 2014, in which the pro-Union side triumphed by 55 percent to 45 percent, followed then-Prime Minister David Cameron’s decision to temporarily hand Holyrood the power to hold a referendum. This time, no such consent from Westminster will be forthcoming.

After pro-independence parties gained a majority of seats in last year’s Holyrood elections, Sturgeon argued her government now had a mandate to hold a fresh vote. In response, Johnson and U.K. ministers have pointed to nationalist statements from 2014 that the first referendum would be a “once in a generation” event, and say Sturgeon’s current focus should be on helping Scots with the cost-of-living-crisis.

Sturgeon will say Tuesday that her preferred option remains a repeat of the 2014 transfer of powers, stating in pre-released remarks: “Westminster rule over Scotland cannot be based on anything other than a consented, voluntary partnership.”

“It is time to give people the democratic choice they have voted for.”

Nationalists and unionists alike expect this plea to fall on deaf ears. An official from the U.K. government said its position in opposition to another referendum would not change.

The most hotly anticipated portion of Sturgeon’s speech will therefore concern how her government plans to hold a referendum if Westminster does not grant consent.

In a press conference earlier this month, Sturgeon stressed that any efforts to hold a referendum must be done “in a lawful manner” — a reference to the widely-held view that either the U.K. government or an activist private citizen would take the Scottish government to court if it tried to hold a referendum against the will of Westminster.

One way to get around the legal difficulties could be to hold a purely advisory poll, according to a former senior civil servant involved in the negotiations for the 2014 referendum.

“Perhaps instead of a ‘referendum on independence,’ the bill is instead about something like asking the people of Scotland for a mandate to open independence negotiations with the U.K,” Ciaran Martin wrote in the Sunday Times. He added that such a measure “might stand a better chance in court.”

Some unionists have made clear they would boycott any consultative poll, regardless of its legality. But with October 2023 penciled in as Sturgeon’s ideal date for a fresh referendum, and legislation to enact a vote expected in Holyrood later this year, a court battle looks increasingly inevitable.


For more polling data from across Europe visit POLITICO Poll of Polls.

** there is an interactive poll graph at the link to the story.   Hugs **


unsavedheathen • 2 hours ago

Congratulations to the Conservative Party of the UK, who as paid agents of the Russian government have installed Russian oligarchs in the House of Lords, compromised the NHS in the middle of a global pandemic, knocked the legs out from under several UK industries, weakened the EU, weakened NATO and brought about the likely dissolution of the UK.

David Cameron, Teresa May, Boris Johnson… traitors to their country, all.

heleninedinburgh • 2 hours ago

Christ. I don’t know if I should bother with this one, since everyone’s going to be talking Braveheart shite.

The SNP have no currency plan.
They are lying about us getting straight into the EU.
Scexit negotiations, if they happened, would make Brexit negotiations look like cancelling a broadband contract, and this time the tories they’d be negotiating with would actually (not in their lies) hold all the cards.

I live in Scotland, and I am dependent on state benefits and the NHS. My appetite for risk is very fucking limited indeed. As is the appetite of most people in Scotland. Unless a non-binding referendum was boycotted, like the private referendum financed by SNP donor Brian Souter when he wanted to keep Section 28, Remain would win.

Oscarlating Wildely heleninedinburgh • an hour ago • edited

First, Braveheart is 20 years old and is an overrated film with the historical accuracy of sheep shit.

Second, not everyone. There is a strange draw I admit in the States to independence from everything it seems, definitely in light of the Crown (talk about a solution in search of a problem), Ireland, and Scotland. As if anything associated with England is tethered to a war that a bunch of colonists won only with the aide of France.

There is definitely a need for more input in terms of Scotland’s access to economically driven initiatives, particularly in the Highlands and the Northern Islands/Hebredes, which, in truth, the SNP doesn’t seem to deal much with at all. The loss of association with the EU definitely hurt crofters for one small example, and of course, the whole fishing industry thing. But those, and even increased voice in Westminster, can be resolved without a total break, which would just create even more chaos. Let’s face it: the economic ties bind; the whole separation thing might have been wonders when Catholics and Protestants were burning each other at the stake, but Mary, we’ve moved on.

It’s not the Scotland hates England; to be honest, that is a very American centric view. Are there representation issues? Yes, but independence is not a strong way to go for a country that is so linked economically to its neighbor to the south, and that is, truly, so small in population to support its own without that economic (and etc.) safety net. We are talking a country that has about 1/.2 the population not of England but only of London. There are too many ties that bind for a complete separation.

Adam Schmidt heleninedinburgh • 40 minutes ago

Honest question here… Right now the EU seems (to my American ass) poised to accelerate membership for a few countries such as Ukraine and Moldova for very obvious reasons. I’m assuming that the expectation is that it wouldn’t do the same for Scotland despite it being a former member because Scotland isn’t under the same kind of threat as Ukraine and Moldova. And thus Scotland would have to go through a some-number-of-years long process to join. Have I got that right?

justme • 2 hours ago

So the great Brexit , that was suppose to fix all of Britians problems ..Didn’t!!

Ann Kah • an hour ago

My uncle, when a student in Edinburgh, was arrested when he climbed a flagpole to replace the Union Jack with the flag of Scotland. That would have been sometime In the late 1930s. Independence has been festering for a long time, but it’s a lot like Texas seceding in that it’ll cause more problems than it solves.

Reality.Bites • an hour ago…

YouGov’s latest tracking data on an independence vote shows that, if there was a vote today, the outcome would be identical to how it was in 2014, with 55% saying they would vote No and 45% Yes. Since the referendum, support for remaining in the UK has tended to be above support for leaving, and while in 2020 we saw the biggest Yes lead of any YouGov poll at 53%, this support has dwindled in subsequent polls through 2021 and 2022.


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